RoryQ

I think it depends, Jeff.
Someone can be drinking in a bar, day in, day out, and you're right - that's not an indicator that they have money. It could be a dive bar, and they could be spending their pay cheque drip by drip until it next comes in.
Same principle could apply with tattooing. Someone could have a lot of coverage but it could be work that they built up incrementally, piece by piece, paying just a little at a time. If they're going to some guy who tattoos in his kitchen then maybe they'll fill up even quicker.
But if someone is getting large scale work done, especially by anyone in a busy and in-demand shop (I'm not even talking about Kat Von D here, I just mean someone in a city like London who is charging the going rate) then I think it does indicate certain resources.
Typically I'd stand by the idea that if you're looking at someone who has a lot of good tattoos then they're probably people with a job or access to a decent amount of money.
If you are living on a welfare payment here you definitely can go to a bar and drink every day. You could also go to a scratcher and accumulate a lot of small tattoos and be covered over time. But I don't think you could afford to lay down enough for a deposit and large work in a reputable shop - the outlay is too big.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

@mmikaoj - thanks for kicking off a good thread, with a lot going on in it.
I would think most of us can get behind the OP's premise that sometimes big name culture can be a poor guide to who to get tattooed by. If the reason someone is chosen as an artist is because they HAVE that big name, not because of what earned it for them, then that's, as @Pugilist said, something like starfucking.
It's not even the same as people who get tattooed by Ami James because he's on TV... It's actually different because it's masquerading as something more like connoisseurship, even though it isn't.
I've been in a couple of shops where I think, objectively speaking (if such s thing is possible) the newer tattooers that were being brought along were clearly going to outstrip their teachers eventually. Jondix and Horiyoshi III must have been rookies and then journeymen too at some stage. There must have been a tipping point somewhere where people getting work from them knew that they were lucky to be in the seat at that time.
Where this thread falls into controversy is when Eddie and Horiyoshi III were somewhat roughly evaluated. I don't agree that Eddie Deutsche has even remotely lost it, FWIW, and in the case of Horiyoshi III I don't know enough to comment. I concluded a while back that his instagram photos were not a good guide, full stop, but a tattooer whose opinion I trust told me he thought that health problems were taking their toll on his tattooing. I would get tattooed by him because of who he is, but I wouldn't go in there expecting it to be like a tattoo done in his prime.
On the whole taking offence / smack talking thing... I don't think anything in this thread has crossed that line yet. So far all I see are honestly held opinions, misguided or subjective perhaps, but no full-blown smack-talking.
I DO want to know where the local shop with tattooers as good as Shige, Horiyoshi III etc is... I'm guessing Rock of Ages or something

I'm still reading the Malazan books.... Glad you're enjoying them.
Right now I'm on Stonewielder by Ian Cameron Esselmont.
The end is in sight... Kind of...
If you want a way to get a bit more detail / clarity / analysis on what's going on, Graeme, then you should check out the Malazan re-read series of blog posts on Tor's website. There are two people who break each book down chapter by chapter and summarise what's happened, and then offer their perspective on it. One of them is reading it for the first time (Amanda) and is, to be honest, worth skipping. But the other poster (Bill) who's reading it for the second time offers some really good pointers on what's going on without actually throwing any spoilers in.
They don't quite serve it up on a plate, it's got more of a book club feel. It's kind of like 'well, how did we like that chapter...?'.
I just like it because I find that it helps me get more out of the books and a full appreciation of what's going on. I felt like I was getting maybe 70% of it otherwise and missing a lot of the subtle stuff that is in there.
As for being epic... Yes, it's quite an amazing series. I don't think there's been anything on this scale before that has managed to crack the mainstream fantasy genre to the same extent?

I'm about half way through Midnight Tides, the fifth book of Steven Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen series which I started reading because of recommendations on this thread. I am in awe at the scope and audacity of this project, and that he actually seems to be pulling off what he set out to achieve: if anything ever deserved the adjective "epic", it's this, and the depth and complexity of the world he created is, as far as I know, unparalleled in fantasy and he's done it (so far) without really any of the expository world building that tends to weigh down the genre. That makes it a challenging, sometimes frustrating read--like in the first chapter of the first book where he's describing a sorcerous battle and is getting into things that he doesn't explain and only gradually reveals over the following thousands of pages--but I think the effort is ultimately worth it.

I'm sorry you've been going through such a hard time but I'm glad that you're starting to see some light. Next time we're in Toronto we'll have to grab a drink with you and Erin.

To me they are a luxury in the sense that ... let's be clear ... paying the mortgage or paying for my son's needs (yes, his wants as well as his needs) are ahead.
I have a few paintings that have accrued in value since I bought em- enough that I guess they count as an investment. I hesitate to say tattoos could be an investment in that sense ... for obvious reasons. No re-sale value.
But...
I would prioritise spending my truly disposable income on them because, as Graeme said, they're gonna be there till death. You get "use" out of your tattoos daily. So much enjoyment and good memories.
In terms of their perceived value: It's interesting to me that most people here (Ireland) don't consciously recognise the cost. When I see someone with big work then - if they aren't obviously patronising scratchers - then I know they are *probably* either someone with a good enough income that they can afford it out of disposable income OR someone who can budget and exercise restraint to save up. Either way, I admire / approve of that.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

This time next week my torso should be all done.
Going up to Nagaoka city to Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle Tattoo.
Looking forward to it, insofar as I ever look forward to sessions on my front. I'll be sad to be finished as it gave me a great excuse to visit Japan regularly.
Tomo's new site, if anyone's interested: silkneedletattoo | Japanese style tattoosilkneedletattoo | Japanese style tattoo

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Thanks everyone.
I don't mind. I said I'd like to get something I could see and enjoy from him. I've always loved his stuff so I didn't want to get something really tucked away.
The plan at the moment is to fit something in at the top of my chest panels and going around the back of my neck. The neckline on my chest panels is pretty low so there is a decent enough space.
Probably ojuzu or a small wrapping dragon or both. But we'll see, I could see that he measured up and was already thinking a lot about it. He was keen on the ojuzu because I think he really likes doing the buddhist imagery.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Absolutely stunning @RoryQ. Well worth the time it took. What do you have planned w/ Shige if you don't mind sharing? Oh and that ramen is a beautiful thing too. It has me craving for some.

Wow @RoryQ that is a phenomenal tattoo (and delicious looking ramen)! Sounds like a great experience all around.

Thumbs up on the Echigo!
Tattoo looks great! Congrats on finishing!

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.

Tomo's new studio, Silk Needle, continues the Yellow Blaze tradition of being somewhat hard to find without GPS / phone map.
The sign is 'blink and you'll miss it'.
Nagaoka is a morning shinkansen's ride from Tokyo... 1.5 hours. The new studio is super comfy and Tomo seems to be planning a lot of conventions in Europe and Canada soon, he's energised.
We did 5 hours, which finished off my front after (I think) 4 years and about six sessions? All in Japan bar one. My bank account is glad that's done.
Drank some awesome Echigo beer on the way home and zoned out till I ate a restorative giant ramen. I lived on ramen this trip: All kinds! Soya base, extra fatty pork base, fish base... Cheap, tasty and hydrating.
Flying home tomorrow but this morning I had a consult with Shige and, all going well, getting a small piece from him at a convention in Europe in next while.